Posted June 6Jun 6 comment_92642 Per FAR part 2, Commercially Available Off-the-shelf(1) Means any item of supply (including construction material) that is– (i) A commercial product (as defined in paragraph (1) of the definition of “commercial product” in this section); (ii) Sold in substantial quantities in the commercial marketplace; and (iii) Offered to the Government, under a contract or subcontract at any tier, without modification, in the same form in which it is sold in the commercial marketplace;I am interested in understanding:1) What constitutes “substantial quantities”? How much is enough?2)What does “without modification” mean when some products are routinely customized in the marketplace?Pulling on that thread, what if a component of the COTS item goes obsolete and is replaced by another commercial component. Does that qualify as a modification?
June 26Jun 26 comment_92797 @P Bisset , as stated in a DOD related guidebook, "COTS products seem like an easy subject, and some have questioned why COTS products should be addressed in this Guide. After all, we believe that we intuitively understand what COTS products are because we procure such products for ourselves every time we shop. However, COTS does have its own challenges and can be complex in an acquisition." So, my response,to your question is "it depends."
June 27Jun 27 comment_92807 In the civilian agencies I know, answer to the Is-it-COTS question is simple, and the stakes are relatively low. "Am I buying exactly the same thing as everyone else"? If yes, COTS. We don't over-think it, unlike the hermeneutical DoD.Exception. If, say, the answer will determine if your thing is a "domestic end product" for FAR 25/Buy America purposes, and the answer matters a lot, then more thought is warranted.On 6/6/2025 at 5:55 PM, P Bisset said:2)What does “without modification” mean when some products are routinely customized in the marketplace?Is the customization of the sort that is, in substantial quantities, sold in the commercial marketplace, used by the general public or non-governmental entities, for non-governmental purposes? If yes, COTS. Is the product being customized uniquely for the government, in a way that isn't readily available to any other customers? If no, COTS.On 6/6/2025 at 5:55 PM, P Bisset said:if a component of the COTS item goes obsolete and is replaced by another commercial component. Does that qualify as a modification?No. On 6/6/2025 at 5:55 PM, P Bisset said:“substantial quantities”Enough for price analysis..Cellebrite, an Israeli company, sells a device that breaks into locked mobile phones, including the occasional iPhone (allegedly). Last I checked, they only sell to law enforcement agencies. DHS buys lots of them. These devices are routinely marked as COTS on FPDS. If that is COTS....
June 28Jun 28 comment_92808 Question:I am looking at a catalog of Randall Made Knives. They come in standard designs. Clearly off-the-shelf. But standard customizations are available, such as engraving one's initials on a hilt.Would such a standard customization mean that an off-the-shelf knife is no longer off-the-shelf?
June 29Jun 29 comment_92814 22 hours ago, Vern Edwards said:Question:I am looking at a catalog of Randall Made Knives. They come in standard designs. Clearly off-the-shelf. But standard customizations are available, such as engraving one's initials on a hilt.Would such a standard customization mean that an off-the-shelf knife is no longer off-the-shelf? The knife remains COTS and then a commercial service to have it engraved.
June 30Jun 30 comment_92823 On 6/28/2025 at 8:00 AM, Vern Edwards said:Question:I am looking at a catalog of Randall Made Knives. They come in standard designs. Clearly off-the-shelf. But standard customizations are available, such as engraving one's initials on a hilt.Would such a standard customization mean that an off-the-shelf knife is no longer off-the-shelf?Good question. I think it depends on whether the engraving is a modification to a product meeting definition (1) of commercial product. I don't think modify is synonymous with change. The American Heritage Dictionary defines modify as "to change in form or character." Does the engraving change the form or character of the knife? I don't think so.
June 30Jun 30 comment_92825 Engraving isn’t modification; converting a sheath knife into a holder is. That’s my opinion.
July 1Jul 1 comment_92826 On 6/6/2025 at 2:55 PM, P Bisset said:Pulling on that thread, what if a component of the COTS item goes obsolete and is replaced by another commercial component. Does that qualify as a modification?Maybe a different analogy to the point of the original post? The Bench Made knife manual thumb opening mechanism is replaced by a spring loaded opening mechanism. Still a COTS, I think so. My reasoning for my first response to the knife example was to suggest another way at looking at determination of COTS versus not COTS. COTS is a subset of commercial item and one could in the context of a contract for a commercial product have two CLINS one for a COTS and one for some type of commercially offered customization to the COTS. By my example please customize the knife to spring activated openning.As I read and re-read the original post I am troubled by the term "obsolete" used in tandem with "another commercial component". Another example if an automobile is COTS does it not stay COTS if stick shift transmission becomes obsolete and is replaced by an automatic transmission? I would have preferred a specific example of what the original poster was concerned about with regard to something COTS that has a component become obsolete and it then is replaced by a different component. The replacement of a component does not seem to modfiy but rather the component is now just different. There is a twist in the original post that needs clarification.
July 3Jul 3 comment_92830 Can one buy the same item “off the shelf” , in the general sense, being a product available in the commercial marketplace, which can be bought and used under a government contract?
Sunday at 07:43 PM5 days comment_92837 From The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language, 5th ed.:mod‧i‧fy mŏd′ə‑fī′v. mod‧i‧fied, mod‧i‧fy‧ing, mod‧i‧fies v. tr.To change in form or character; alter.To make less extreme, severe, or strong: refused to modify her stand on the issue. GrammarTo qualify or limit the meaning of. For example, summer modifies day in the phrase a summer day. LinguisticsTo change (a vowel) by umlaut.mod‧i‧fi‧ca‧tion mŏd′ə‑fĭ‑kā′shən n. The act or process of modifying or the condition of being modified.A change or a result produced by modifying: new modifications in the car’sdesign. LinguisticsA change undergone by a word that is borrowed from another language.A phonological change undergone by a word or morpheme when it is used in a construction, as the change of will to 'll in they'll.mod′i‧fi‧ca′torn.mod′i‧fi‧ca′to‧ry‑kā′tə‑rē, mod′i‧fi‧ca′tive‑kā′tĭvadj.*So, what kind of change to a commercially-available off the shelf product be a "modification" of a commercial available off-the-shelf product, as mentioned in the FAR definition? Change of what?Or, would any and every kind of change to any part of the product constitute such a modification?
Monday at 06:28 PM4 days comment_92842 22 hours ago, Vern Edwards said:So, what kind of change to a commercially-available off the shelf product be a "modification" of a commercial available off-the-shelf product, as mentioned in the FAR definition? Change of what?Or, would any and every kind of change to any part of the product constitute such a modification?"any and every" would of course be far too high a bar. In a complex commercial offering (say, a vehicle), minor changes are made often in response to a global, shifting supply chain. Maybe the glue used to hold the company logo to the dashboard was changed. Maybe a lubricant for the springs was swapped because it was cheaper or better (or both). And of course for COTS software, the good ones are in a constant state of modification. For many of them (like security applications), a good part of what you pay for is that they keep up with the threat landscape through constant modification. So you appeal to "form or character" and its continued availability in the commercial marketplace. Questions like "does this deviate from the brochure" and "does this still do what we need it to do" seem to answer the form/character part, while a simple "who can buy this" answers the commercial availability part. Maybe there's been decisions that shape this a bit, but this has that "I know it when I see it" feel.
Tuesday at 01:52 PM4 days comment_92848 19 hours ago, jayandstacey said:minor changes are made often in response to a global, shifting supply chainI can't find anything specific to back this up, but it seems like a critical implicit part of the meaning of modification in this specific definition is "who is asking for the modification?"If the vendor unilaterally chooses to modify their product based on a shifting supply chain, advances in manufacturing, security updates, or any other business decision it would not seem to constitute a "modification" for the purposes of the definition, otherwise there would be no such thing as a commercially available off the shelf product beyond the first version ever produced.So for the definition to make sense it must refer specifically to modifications requested by the purchaser. This doesn't fully answer the original question, since I think it is still not clear whether a product commonly sold in the commercial marketplace with customer-specified modifications, such as a custom-engraved knife, is COTS, but I think it is reasonably safe to ignore modifications that aren't made on behalf of the buyer.
Tuesday at 06:12 PM3 days comment_92854 4 hours ago, Witty_Username said:I can't find anythingI can buy into the thought, but as usual my mind starts to go haywire. 4X8 piece of plywood from lumber vendor but I ask for it to be cut into 2X4 before I leave the store, or for that matter the same with a bundle of 4X8's please cut into 2X4 before delivering. I am not trying to make it difficult, just saying I think like anything in acquisition "it depends" and the specific need will dictate for any commercial product (or service?) as to whether it fits the subset of COTS or not!
Tuesday at 09:45 PM3 days comment_92855 In my opinion, you cannot determine whether an item is COTS without also looking at the definition of Commercial Product, as a portion of that definition is incorporated by reference into the COTS definition.The COTS definition states in part:Commercially available off-the-shelf (COTS) item — (1)Means any item of supply (including construction material) that is– (i)A commercial product (as defined in paragraph (1) of the definition of “commercial product” in this section);Paragraph (1) of the Commercial Product definition states: (1) A product, other than real property, that is of a type customarily used by the general public or by nongovernmental entities for purposes other than governmental purposes, and– (i)Has been sold, leased, or licensed to the general public; or (ii)Has been offered for sale, lease, or license to the general public;Importantly, the COTS definition incorporates only Paragraph (1) and does not include the other categories of Commercial Products such as (2) products evolved from Commercial Products and not yet commercially available but will be by the time of delivery, or (3) Commercial Products with certain types of Modifications.By incorporating only the portion of the Commercial Product definition that does not contemplate any modifications and then reinforcing the point by stating the COTS item must be “Offered to the Government, under a contract or subcontract at any tier, without modification,” suggests there cannot be any change from what is sold to the general public in substantial quantities.The fact that there are different versions of the same item sold to the general public doesn’t mean that you are getting something modified. For example, Apple sells iPad models with different amounts of memory. When you ask a vendor for an iPad with 2TB of storage, you are not asking Apple to make a modification of a 1TB iPad. Each unmodified model is sold by Apple in substantial quantities to the general public and is a COTS item.But, Apple also offers Custom Engraving and Personalization of iPads. This is a modification of a type customarily available in the commercial marketplace. Therefore, under Commercial Product definition (3)(i), it would still be a Commercial Product. However, it would NOT be COTS because it does not fall under definition (1) and it has been modified.What if I ask Apple to deliver a camouflage iPad, which (let’s assume) is not available in the commercial marketplace? I would still consider this to be a Commercial Product because changing the color to camouflage is a Minor Modifications that while not customarily available in the commercial marketplace is made to meet Federal Government requirements and does not significantly alter the nongovernmental function or essential physical characteristics of an item or component, or change the purpose of a process. But, again, it would NOT be a COTS item because it has been Modified and relies on Commercial Product definition (3)(ii) not definition (1).What if Apple has an upgraded iPad that is 10 times more powerful and will be released and sold the general public next month when the government requires delivery? This would be a Commercial Product under definition (2), but not under definition (1) and therefore not COTS.So, there are lots of ways for items to qualify as a Commercial Product. But, in my opinion, if you have to provide instructions to the vendor beyond telling them the quantity and the item name, stock number, or other identifier, then you are drifting away from Commercial Product definition (1), and while it still may be a Commercial Product it is likely not COTS.
Wednesday at 10:42 AM3 days comment_92859 16 hours ago, C Culham said:I can buy into the thought, but as usual my mind starts to go haywire. 4X8 piece of plywood from lumber vendor but I ask for it to be cut into 2X4 before I leave the store, or for that matter the same with a bundle of 4X8's please cut into 2X4 before delivering. I am not trying to make it difficult, just saying I think like anything in acquisition "it depends" and the specific need will dictate for any commercial product (or service?) as to whether it fits the subset of COTS or not!Asking for the lumber yard to cut the plywood isn’t a customer required modification to cots materials in my opinion, because they generally have standard additional charges for that, if they indeed do cuts. At least around here.I think the key, as suggested above is whether you are buying a product (or service) in the form that it is available to and sold to the general public.
Wednesday at 12:59 PM3 days comment_92863 I stand ready to be corrected as I have not fully researched and thought about the following yet offer the thought. Since COTS is a subset of commercial item what advantage does declaring something COTS bring to the acquisition table? It seems the advantage is with with regard FAR 12.505. If so then it would seem that if a modification does not dip into such things as Buy American then why worry. By the examples offered in previous posts cutting the plywood not a big deal as nothing is added (dare I say modified), components added (modified) to computer maybe but what if the camo iPad where the camo case was made completely in the USA. Should I worry about COTS or not?
Wednesday at 01:50 PM3 days comment_92865 The lesson of this thread is that it is very difficult to write airtight definitions, That's why I can't wait to see the Revolutionary FAR Overhaul's rewrite of FAR Part 2, which contains about 260 definitions, only 61 of which are from the U.S.C.
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