dmuir Posted June 13, 2019 Report Share Posted June 13, 2019 My company is responding to a solicitation. The KO has issued a clarification that the contract Any order awarded under this solicitation would be Fixed Priced Level of Effort and would not be Firm Fixed Price. The hours would be billed as they are worked and separated out in each invoice. In reviewing, 16.207, I don't understand how 16.201-1(b) applies. Do we get the Fixed Price regardless of LOE delivered (at the end)? (This seems to contradict the instructions from the KO above). Or do we only get a unit price per hour worked? If we provide the LOE does the contract end? Or like an ordinary FFP, do we still need to work to complete the POP? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ji20874 Posted June 13, 2019 Report Share Posted June 13, 2019 It is very possible that the contracting officer does not understand FFP-LOE. However, we don't understand much about your situation, as you haven't offered much. How is the solicitation's bid schedule set up? For example, 1 JB, or 6 MO, or 5,000 HR? What is the solicitation asking for? A product? A report? Employee hours? Does the solicitation specify a level of effort? Are you supposed to specify a level of effort in your proposal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest PepeTheFrog Posted June 13, 2019 Report Share Posted June 13, 2019 PepeTheFrog doesn't know if this applies to this scenario, but suspects that it might. Here's a magic trick. The FAR and other guidance strongly discourages the use of labor hour (time and materials) contracts. Lots of paperwork and oversight! So, you take a "Fixed Price Level of Effort" (?) contract. The contract "hours would be billed as they are worked and separated out in each invoice." The contractor invoices said hours each month. By magic, you have something that resembles, in some ways, a labor hours contract. But you don't have to worry about as much paperwork and oversight! No, it's a "Fixed Price Level of Effort" contract. Well, OK. PepeTheFrog is not endorsing this whatsoever, just pointing out that it happens. PepeTheFrog also shares @ji20874 suspicion that perhaps the contracting officer doesn't understand FFP-LOE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmuir Posted June 13, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2019 Thank you for attempting answers with the small amount of information I left. It is for services Base + 4 options and a specific # of hours per labor category was specified. This is a recompete and the previous contract was FFP. Also, until this specific direction from the KO, we thought it was FFP. So do we get to bill the full FFP amount or are we invoicing only based on hours worked? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ji20874 Posted June 13, 2019 Report Share Posted June 13, 2019 How is the solicitation's bid schedule set up? For example, 1 JB, or 6 MO, or 5,000 HR? _______________. What is the solicitation asking for? A product? A report? Employee hours? Services. Does the solicitation specify a level of effort? Are you supposed to specify a level of effort in your proposal? The solicitation specifies the level of effort. You really need to answer the first question before I can be helpful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmuir Posted June 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 The bid schedule is set up by hours by LCAT. Thank yoU! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ji20874 Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 So, something like-- Item Supplies/Services Qty Unit Unit Price Amount 001 LCAT 1 100 HR $__________ $__________ 001 LCAT 2 800 HR $__________ $__________ 003 LCAT 3 400 HR $__________ $__________ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmuir Posted June 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 Yes! They acknowledge that they want us to use 2008 hours and we won't really be able to provide that ceiling. They want it in case they want to have extra work... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmuir Posted June 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 Our concern at this point is that we don't want 2008 hours to be considered a deliverable. We are putting language in the business volume to document our assumption. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ji20874 Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 This really doesn't seem like a FFP-LOE approach as contemplated by FAR 16.207; rather, it seems like a FFP approach as contemplated by FAR 16.202. It seems that this is a plain, ordinary FFP approach, with the unit denominated in hours. You will be paid the FFP for each hour authorized by the Government, up to a total of 2008 HRs. The QTY is an estimated quantity, or maybe a ceiling quantity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C Culham Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 If you get get selected to negotiate consider the possibility of having them annotate the CLIN schedule with hours as "estimated" and propose a clause like FAR 52.211-18 for inclusion in the contract. While used in construction I have seen it used in service contracts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
here_2_help Posted June 17, 2019 Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 So, not a T&M type, then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmuir Posted June 17, 2019 Author Report Share Posted June 17, 2019 They specifically said FFP-LOE (because T&M would take approval from the agency Chief KO). But I will look at those clauses for our assumptions! Thank you so much!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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